Pay close attention to the details of this and you can see how this company makes their money.
Itâ€™s pretty plain and simple, cut and dry â€“ with their bait and switch tactics, but what you need to know is this is how they operate.
On August 26th this company Hunter Exchange contacted our company asking about the wholesale of wireless devices. Being in the industry and seeing these emails often, I was hesitant to reply, but did so to see if they were able to get devices for me. With them being located in Canada they would be at an advantage in getting the devices that I needed, as well as us being able to sell to them. It could be a mutually beneficial relationship.
The emails went back and forth as we discussed the details and what stock was available and we were ready to do our first transaction.
â€œI can in no way get 100 Galaxies on the fly.... other yes. I can get aprox 20 for now. I am told I can get the remainder in 1 week.
Just so we are clear these are branded Telus and Bell.â€ â€“ Hunter Exchange
This is an expert from an email from one of the people at Hunter (whom none of which use a signature in their emails, so you really have no idea if you are talking to the scamming owner or the helpless people they hire to help run their scams).
I said I am ready to do business and what do we do next. (Please note that all of this information is documented if anyone wishes to contact us for proof).
They replied with an email requiring some information from me along with their wire information which has been kept classified in this email.
â€œIf you wish to do large transactions I suggest using our account method. I can accept US so you loose nothing in currency exchange.
Please be prepared to provide one of the following pieces of identification when conducting transactions with HunterEx:
Permanent Resident Card
Also needed are:
One form of identification confirming the customerâ€™s address, i.e. phone bill or a utility bill.
Your current permanent address
Your phone number
If you are presenting cash for a transaction equal to or exceeding $10,000 Canadian or equivalent in foreign currency, please be prepared to also provide:
If you have concerns on why these measures are in place rest assured that these procedures are common place and is part of our Laundering Policy. Hunter Exchange Canada has developed anti-money laundering policies to ensure that company personnel comply with applicable laws and regulations when engaging in foreign exchange services to clients.
HunterEx adheres to the International Money Laundering Abatement and Anti-Terrorist Financing Act of 2001 and regulations based on that legislation. The companyâ€™s anti-money laundering policies and procedures are designed to meet the requirements of the legislation by minimizing the opportunity for customers to engage in money laundering activities through transactions in the ForEx markets. HunterEx procedures are focused on â€œknowing the customerâ€.
If you require any further information, please contact us at any time.
Wire Payments (Inbound) for Personal and Commercial Customers
Payment from the USA
Customer provides the initiating financial institution with:
Our customer information including beneficiary account name and address details.
5-3024 Hurontario St.
Now we had agreed on a price of the devices, and then a day later (prior to wiring) they came back and saying there is a tax on these devices. I kindly stated that since they are shipping out of the country there is no tax that needed to be collected. They accepted this fact and accepted the PO, and the funds were wired.
I sent the funds and then sent them an email
â€œ24350.00 was just wired, this should cover the fee and anything else. No need to refund in excess. Please send official invoice once this is shipped. Please use the details on the purchase order to ship my order. Contact me immediately if there are any issues, I would like an open communication for this as itâ€™s a fairly large order and I am again wiring $25k to Canada.â€
3 more emails to them and 24 hours goes by so I send another email â€œPlease consider me officially worried at this point. I wired over $25k to you and have seen one email. No tracking, no order details. I need to see something from you in the next hour here. Please advise.â€
They replied to me â€œSir there is no need to be alarmed. You wired funds to us and we received it the next day. We have to wait for the shipments to come in. Once they do we ship out. Our shipments (We ship out) usually take 4-5 business days. This is normal procedure. We have not reach the 4th day as of yet. Please keep this in mind.
If you have any concerns you can call us directly at
888-800-6838 ext 7544â€
Now where did they say 4-5 days prior to this? They said 48 hours, thatâ€™s 2 days. And now Iâ€™m upset. I dealt with scamming companies in Canada before who feel they can do anything they want with US Companies money, Reidcom (Kevin Reid) to be exact. So my next email to them was not a polite one:
â€œIn our communication there wasnâ€™t an instance stated that would take 4-5 days, had I known this I wouldnâ€™t be wiring any funds. You need to put yourself in my shoes sir, I wired $30k to a Canadian expecting overnight and got nothing. I wired you $25k and got an email claiming you â€œreceived my orderâ€, nothing to do with â€œwireâ€. The shipping method used to ship me the stock should be Priority international. The stock should arrive to me by Friday if itâ€™s shipped today, which according to your email it should. Please let me know if there are any delays.â€
Have you received tracking from your vendor shipping to you? Do you plan to ship to me today?â€
This next email from them just blew my mind. Please read this closely.
â€œHi I got 40 of the 60 phones. That is the legend and Desires. The Galaxy S is still on route. However I am being charged regardless for the taxes on these units. I am told you do not pay taxes however I must charge my cost. We have a NEW tax called the HST and this started almost 2 months ago
Now this is a problem. So I know about your history. So. I can reimburse you back your funds or we can move forward but I have to charge you everything. The invoice I sent is incorrect because I have TAX. The truth of the matter is the tax should be included into the quote of each unit.
I have documentation here: http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/E/pub/gp/rc4027/README.html
and a direct number here: 1-800-95-5525
I will admit I have never send such a large quantity over the boarder. I have however sold 300 - 600 within Canada when the Iphone debut so this isn't about the quantity its more about the border issue and new HST tax introduced into Canada.
What should I do. To refund I need your informaiton. I will also reimburse any fees you had to do to send the money.
I will do what ever you wish with no loss to you.
I have to either return this in whole or purchase it whole because of the large amount. If I take 20 and send back the rest it looks like I made an error. They are on top of that up here. People used to order over the amount they need and send back what doesn't sale all the time in the past. So they charge for restocking. If I return everything and make noise it would not apply esp. if I say the order was canceled due to HST issues.
If you want to go ahead. I can get 100 of each item within 4-5 days. This I can confirm and guarantee. The delay is the confirmation of money. This is not done by visa/Amex/MC its cash so when it shows people act. This always delay things by a day. Me waiting on confirmation from you made a delay. So we understand. It takes me 1-2 days to ship once I have money depending on the time I get the money. This does not include holidays or Fridays.
I know. This is Canada. We are not backwards just not as saturated and overpopulated like the US.
OHKAY... so then on that note... the price for the Samsung Galaxy S would be $*** Each. HTC Desire same price $*** each. HTC Legend I can do for $***. You handle shipping.
Believe it or not I make no profit. I am doing this to build a relationship so I can purchase from you in the future. I can show you all our invoices.
I await your response and will not delay on your wishesâ€
So now these people are charging me the tax that they were charged, after quoting me a different price. They didnâ€™t factor in the tax they were being charged when they quoted me the price and now they want to try and collect this. Which is a 20%+ price point. My next pissed off email was deserved:
â€œThis is absolutely absurd. You have never done business like this before? You do have to charge tax, BUT YOU GET THIS TAX BACK with proof of the export. All you must do to get this tax back is to provide the copy of the invoice. I have done over 6 million dollars in business with Canadian suppliers and HAVE NEVER paid tax in my entire existence. I realize that you want to make a profit, but BAIT AND SWITCH is not the kind of way to go about it. You are charged tax, but you can get that tax back. Please investigate this and ship my order today as I need it Monday. I will not be buying anything else from you if this order goes sour, regardless of the price or communication or lack their of. Please research this before it gets out of hand. You can get the tax back. Itâ€™s the law.â€
No reply from them on any of this, so my next email said
â€œI need the stock that you have, shipped to me today. Please use the details in the PO to ship it FedEx International Priority.â€
I didnâ€™t care at this point what the price was I just wanted the stock. Just wanted them to ship me what they had as I knew a scam was in the works. Another email sent to them:
â€œI need them shipped today, please ship them and we can discuss this money issue later. Please simply ship my devices to me.â€
They emailed me back shortly thereafter:
â€œThis is not a "Bait and Switch" as you put it. I said clearly I can reimburse you plus any fees you encountered. What would I gain from doing that?
I understand you had a loss previously but that was not our company. You more than likly paid tax but it was within the cost of the unit. If you read the NEW LAW that was released here in June. HST TAX... we are charged regardless.
The only way you can purchase 300+ phones is to order directly from Ingram Micro. You have to have an account with them. I am not sure if they do that with clients outside of Canada. You would then need a business here.
I understand you are upset. I am being charged Taxes from the distributor. I will not get that back. I have been on the phone with HST for the whole day trying to get this to work.
When was the last order you did from Canada? Any after the HST?â€
My next email to them was assuming that I am being scammed now, as I can clearly see that they are doing nothing to assist. I know now that they are a scam of a company; HUNTER EXCHANGE is officially a scam. Here is my email:
I realize that this isn't your main form of business; I also realize that you have not been scammed. Sir, I have and this is how they start. I need a reply here before I take this to the next level. Please do not consider this a threat; I will just need to do what I can to mitigate damages in this occurrence. I have educated myself on covering my a$$ when it comes to dealing with cross border orders, and I do not like to be tested.
With that being said, I will pay the price of the stock in which we did NOT agree upon, but the price of the stock after I have paid you. You have the stock in hand, you claim, so send the stock. This should not take 2 days to get a tracking number from you, and you are slowly losing all credibility with your constant delay and ignorance of this matter.
This is my business so I know how it should be run. When someone pays for stock, you ship them the stock. Please do so Monday or I will be forced to take action.
(Not a good start if you ask me, you're not putting forth any effort to reconcile your actions, and this is going to be terminal for future transactions).â€
So now HUNTER EXCHANGE is feeling threatened? that I want the stock that I paid for to be shipped to me. Odd that a customer wiring 24,000 would want anything in return, their email to me flipped my lid:
â€œI am starting to realize this has nothing to do with you being scammed. I will keep this simple.
Send me your banking information and I will send you back your money. I personally know the laws. The little stunt you just tried to do was intimidation. So I loose a large amount of money I paid in taxes by shipping because "I donâ€™t want to get in trouble." Its like I am dealing with some Nigerian Scam or something. I am starting to wonder if the money deposited is clear legitimate money. No business rushes someone to send the way you are. I even stated to reimburse and you still wanted me to ship when I told you clearly I must either buy all or return all.
Sorry, obviously there has been a communication break down and I don't need to force any issues with you.
All specific Information to wire and I will send back your money. I DO HOPE this transfer will be the same it originates from. In other words I am not wiring to your friend in Florida because you on vacation in Europe.
I away you refunding instructions.â€
So now you see the scam. They are playing a sort of â€œreverse psychologyâ€ here and trying to assume that WE are scamming him by blindly sending him the 24k.
Right now I am about as pissed off at HUNTER EXCHANGE as anyone could possibly be. They â€œclaimâ€ they have the stock, but can not ship it to me, and then â€œclaimâ€ they need to wire me back a refund. Then they accuse my legitimate wire to be something less than that? I almost lost it, I simply sent over the wire information with the following note:
â€œSend the funds back; you obviously can not deliver what you promised. I do feel bad for people that do business with you on either side.
Add the $35 wire fee as well.â€
After all that was sent, I still get this email from HUNTER EXCHANGE:
â€œSorry, after the threats bad language and poor communication we were clearly told not to communicate with you until you give us back your bank information.
I will pass this on.
Overall, sorry things did not work out between the two companies. I think there was a gross misunderstanding with product and taxes. I personally saw the units and understand why it had to be addresses. I assume once it was addressed, the relationship deteriorated.
HunterEx has never had issues with any other customers. Google if you do not believe us. You are literally the first.
In any event. I will send back these units and proceed with your refund in USD plus $35 USD.â€
â€œThe poor communication was not on my part. Even when I said ship the damn devices at whatever price you need, you still didnâ€™t ship. Just incapable of doing any business, thatâ€™s what it comes down to. Send the wire proof. I covered my a$$ to the max on this as I knew I was getting scammed, so I have people standing by if the wire doesnâ€™t go through.â€
Then Hunter Exchange started to attempt to get smart with me. Sending this:
â€œYou threaten us one more time and you will have a problem. Do you know what the definition of the word scam?
Obviously you donâ€™t. Stop with the libel comments. I am getting emails from my workers saying they are afraid to check the emails?
Because you have someone waiting for them? For the meantime, this is civil but I see its slowly trickling into harassment.
Keep it professional. No more personal libel comments or innuendo threats.
I see this is escalating. I will have to contact my legal representatives regarding threats and libel actsâ€
So here is what The Hunter Exchange Scam is. They collect your money, hold your money, when you get pissed and want your money back, they contact legal representation and use your money to pay them.
My reply was simple, obviously these were not threats. These were facts and they would be followed up on. My email read:
â€œThese are not threats sir. I will send someone over there to pick up my money if you do not send it. That is not a threat, that is a PROMISE sir. And if you do not wire me back by the end of the day I will report this to every government agency you report to. You find these threats? Then send the money back. This will hurt you more than it will hurt me. You can not do a thing to me as you are in process of running away with my money. This is a felony, do you know what that is or do I need to send you a link? And do you think you can operate a currency exchange company once I report that you knowingly took $24,000 from me and refuse to give it back? Check your self man. This is just hurting you.â€
As any one would do, instead of a refund, I simply asked if someone could pick up the stock. As I knew I was getting scammed, this was a perfectly good way to verify for sure. So I sent someone over to see this companies shitty location and talk to someone who had enough sense to SPEAK to someone instead of just emailing. So I sent my friend Jay over there, and no one knew what was going on. Then Jay talked to Terry Hunter on the phone. He was very calm about everything, so after they got off the phone, Jay emailed Terry. Asked if he could pick up the stock.
I get this email from them â€œPlease do not contact us again. Your threats have gone far enough.
Your wire transfer is in process and your refund will be with you within 6-8 weeks if not sooner.â€
6-8 weeks? 6-8 weeks? 6-8 weeks? Are you kidding me!! I wire them and its 24 hours and when they want to refund me its 6-8 weeks. Oh no, that is not how I work here. I immediately went to Google and posted their reply to my emails and called them an outright scam which they are. The Hunter Exchange Scam. Also found herewww.hunterexchangescam.com
I get an email from John Hunter from Hunter Exchange (who also copied Jay) that is just off the wall, Please read this email from him:
â€œWell this is John Hunter. I initially spoke to Ryan J. Negri about this purchase.
Be well advised we are reviewing the threats made and considering criminal action. Any damage or abuse done to any employee or property of HunterEx will be put into consideration and investigated with Mr. Ryan J. Negri as a Prime suspect. I have been told as well you are his Canadian contact that will be "paying us visits".
I warn you do not cross the legal line. I do respect concern but we are now entering illegal actions that bring concern to the safety of my staff. We have all voice conversations and emails recorded. This is not a bluff.
He has slandered our name and posted multiple libel comments about our company. On 14 Sep 2010 he posted libel comments on Google and I do believe the time from his transfer to our accounts and for us to order does not indorse him calling ALL our stores and employees scammers. We are now seeking legal counsel and suggest you do not communicate with us any further.
Any acts or comments or communication from hence forth will be considered harassment.
If you wish to contact us, we suggest you communicate with Sidney Klotz Law firm. 416.243.2222 ex 301
On a side note. I hope you are not in the same mind set as Mr. Negri. We can't deliver product that has almost 4,000 still owing on it. We are not TAX EXEMPT. We have accounts with Ingram Micro who does our phone orders with Mobilicity and we have associates with Telus. We cannot defraud a person that wants us to lose money.
He went way overboard and I do not endorse that activity. To be fair and just I will let you know from his threats we sent back inventory the day he started doing libel acts. We do not want and have been advised not to do any business with this person.
I am also investigating all other websites he posted on. Google is apparently only one of them.
Attached are some of the communication and documents that we have gathered.
To this day I have yet to see a wire and itâ€™s now been 9 months. They will not refund me and they continue to send emails from their attorneys saying that Canadian Law is different that US law as far as the time allotted to refund. They are sending me bills for their attorney fees, and they are threatening legal action.
They take your money, they will not give it back, when you become angry and want to get it back they try to get lawyers involved. They will end up netting around $20k after all is said and done, pure profit.
THE HUNTER EXCHANGE SCAM!
Any attorneys that would like to assist in the recovery of these funds please email me at firstname.lastname@example.org
Anyone wishing to help with the recovery of the funds please email me as well. Anyone that can provide information leading to the prosecution of this companies members please email me â€“ a $5000 reward is also being offered for recovery of the funds.
All the information noted above has support documents available on request. Please let me know if you can assist.
Visit Hunter Exchange Scam for all the details on this Fraud Company. Steer clear of their 3 locations as well.
Hunter Exchange Canada
788 Dundas Street West, Toronto, ON M6J 1V1, Canada (888) 800-6838
Hunter Exchange Canada
386 Royal York Road, Etobicoke, ON M8Y 2R3, Canada (888) 800-6838
Hunter Exchange Canada
144 Simcoe St, Toronto, ON M5H 3C6, Canada (888) 800-6838